Teaching your RR who's in charge

[oscarsmom]

Thank you guys for recognizing I'm not out to pick a fight.

I came back to this thread thinking "Oh no, I bet I pissed people off" and I'm glad that the pitchforks aren't out.

No worries!

~Natalya

[Breezybare]

Wow there has been a lot of great information here.  I have picked up a few new things myself.  So thanks to everyone...

The great advice by all about setting the good positive foundation early, finding out what works best for your dog, because each is different.  Be sure to catch him or her as they are doing what you want and start reinforcing that early.  This way they will learn exactly what pleases you from the beginning and that will become there life's mission.

I think what I learned as a last resort was a bit different from the 'alpha roll'.  I think I heard it called pinning.  This is where they are put on their side, not completely submissive by exposing their underbelly, but they still get the point.  You are supposed to hold them there until they quit squirming, and then they can be released.  And I have seen this done by other alpha dogs.  One of which was about a year old Golden who came over to play with my pup.  She was relentless with her play and puppy teeth.  He was getting tired, and just put pressure on her upper shoulder.  He was gentle and kind, and she got the point.  I think there lies an important key, gentle and kind.

I am not sure if I can quote someone, but here is goes hopefully I am quoting it correctly....
"We are in luck if, in training a dog, we can use his instincts as a basis for what we require.  For the more instinctive an action is, the more reliable it will be."

Sabrina

 

[Rosebud]

I think what I learned as a last resort was a bit different from the 'alpha roll'.  I think I heard it called pinning.  This is where they are put on their side, not completely submissive by exposing their underbelly, but they still get the point.  You are supposed to hold them there until they quit squirming, and then they can be released.  And I have seen this done by other alpha dogs.  One of which was about a year old Golden who came over to play with my pup.  She was relentless with her play and puppy teeth.  He was getting tired, and just put pressure on her upper shoulder.  He was gentle and kind, and she got the point.  I think there lies an important key, gentle and kind.

Momma dogs will do this to pups that get to pestersome. They just put their paw on the pup. Yes it is a gentle correction, meant to just let the pup know they are getting to big for their britches.

But I have seen this tactic used in subtler and more gentle, affectionate ways....Sally will do this to Rocket (who is already laying down) when she is trying to clean his face and ears. He will squirm and fuss a little bit about getting his face washed so Sally will very gently put her paw on his shoulder as if she's telling him "I hate it for you, but you need your faced washed", he just sighs and lays down. When she's done Rocket is happy and bouncy and looking to ME for a cookie. It is soooo sweet to watch.

[kitoyogi]

I think what I learned as a last resort was a bit different from the 'alpha roll'.  I think I heard it called pinning.  This is where they are put on their side, not completely submissive by exposing their underbelly, but they still get the point.  You are supposed to hold them there until they quit squirming, and then they can be released.  And I have seen this done by other alpha dogs.  One of which was about a year old Golden who came over to play with my pup.  She was relentless with her play and puppy teeth.  He was getting tired, and just put pressure on her upper shoulder.  He was gentle and kind, and she got the point.  I think there lies an important key, gentle and kind.

Pinning is what I actually did with Xhabbo as a puppy, not a real alpha roll but it is putting the dog/puppy in a more submissive position so it does establish dominance.  I think this did lay a good foundation.   I'm not sure that I have actually even seen a real alpha roll.  I've heard about Cesar Milan but never actually seen his show. 

I just watch how the mother reacts to her pups and how adult dogs that are in a pack type environment.  Some RR friend's and I walk our dogs at an off leash park on a regular basis and it is interesting to see how some of the older dogs and bitches react to the younger ones - similar to how the dam reacts to her pups - sometimes by making a lots of noise and putting the younger dogs head to the ground with their heads and the younger dog often seeks out the more dominant dog.  The dominant dogs aren't hurting the younger ones but simply making a point of who is in charge.  This is usually only done when one from the pack has not been around on a regular basis and needs a reminder.

The pinning helps the dog understand that they have to put up with being handled.  This is beneficial for doing nails, showing, vet visits, etc.  I think show class, particularly the examinations really help train a dog to be handled.  Xhabbo has always a good atitude with the examinations while showing and during show class.